SMALLVILLE’s Allison Mack Talks NXIVM, Branding, and Suicidal Thoughts

Allison Mack, who played the role of Chloe Sullivan in the Superman prequel series Smalltown, was arrested in 2018 for his involvement in the cult known as NXVIM, led by Keith Raniere. Marketed as a sort of self-help group, NXIVM arguably became the center of one of the biggest sex scandals in recent memory. In 2021, the actress, who pleaded guilty for racketeering and conspiracy – was sentenced to three years in federal prison. Mack was released in 2023. Now, two years after her release, she makes a surprising appearance in Michael Rosenbaum’s film. Inside you podcast.

The podcast took a deep dive into Mack’s story, through his time in NXIVM, his prison sentence and finally, his release and dealing with the consequences of his actions. Speaking about her actions with NXIVM, Mack said that while she didn’t seek power, she enjoyed the feeling that came with it. However, her actions within the cult caused her to struggle with her perception of herself, as she oscillated between seeing herself as “the worst human being on the planet” to someone who had good intentions:

“I wasn’t looking for power, but I’m not going to lie and say that power didn’t feel good. […] You know, when you’re under house arrest for three and a half years and then in prison for two years, you spend a lot of time thinking about what happened, how you got there, and what you did. […] I yo-yoed between the two: ‘I’m the worst human being on the planet.’ I am all these horrible things. I’m horrible. You know, “devastated.” And then I would go back and be like, ‘Well, no, I’m also, like… I had good intentions here, and I wanted to make This here.’ And I look at my journals and I say to myself, “I thought This here, so I don’t think I’m horrible.'”

Mack then said that ultimately she had to accept the fact that she was a human being with “light” and “dark” sides. This, she said, helped her recognize the things she should take with her as a lesson, and the things she could forgive herself for:

“[It] It was this back-and-forth dance of responsibility and justification and confusion, until finally you were like, “Okay, I’m a human being, who has darkness and light. I found myself in a really complicated situation, with very powerful people who had incredible ways of manipulating people over long periods of time. And: “What have I done that I must stay with in my consciousness for the rest of my life so as not to do it again?” And what have I done so that I can forgive myself? And then, with that knowledge, you move forward, hopefully wisely, and try to do better on the other side. »

Rosenbaum asked Mack if she knew where things started to change in NXIVM. Mack said that, like the dynamics present in abusive relationships, she began justifying smaller situations that slowly escalated:

“I mean, my God, I was involved for 12 years. And things didn’t start to get really dysfunctional and illegal until the eighth or ninth year of my involvement. So it was like a very stereotypical situation, now that I think about it.—grooming progress that has occurred over a period of time. […] It was a different form of abusive relationship, where you make a decision to justify something that’s very important at the time, but you’re like, “Oh, okay, I can figure out how to fix things in my head.” And then, that becomes normal and normal. And then the next thing that happens that’s extreme, you justify and figure out how to make things acceptable and normal, and then all of a sudden you do something totally different than you expected. But this happened gradually, over time, and we don’t notice it. »

Accept your actions and their consequences

Speaking about her role in NXIVM, Mack said one thing she struggled to understand was the way she treated people while she was in the cult: “[One] One of the things I’m faced with regularly is, “How have I objectified people to the point where I thought it was okay to take away their autonomy?” Like, how did I get to the point where this was something I thought was acceptable? And how did I get to the point where I thought it was okay to feel like I had power over people?’”

Rosenbaum suggested that this was similar to the concept that good people do bad things. Mack responded that she struggled with the concept of calling people “good” or “bad”: “I really struggle with the idea of ​​good and bad people.” THE Smalltown the actress explained that she works with people in prison who have done “really horrible” things, but she doesn’t consider them bad people. Turning the subject to herself and her situation, she said: “[I] I know I’ve done some really bad things and I don’t think I’m a bad person.”

Later in the interview, Mack revealed that she was not allowed to be in contact with friends from prison due to her probation, and went on to explain her probation restrictions: “I can’t leave the county without permission. I have a monitor on my phone and on my computer, so they know who I’m talking to.” Rosenbaum asked him if law enforcement could listen in on his conversations. Mack responded that she didn’t know, but assured her former co-star that she wouldn’t do anything illegal, as she was undergoing rehabilitation:

“I’m not going to do anything. I believe I’m rehabilitated, and I’ll always be in the process of being rehabilitated. I think I’ll be in therapy forever, but I understand very clearly what happened and that it was wrong, so I’m not worried about doing that. But I have friends on the inside that I would like to connect with when I’m off probation, because they are very good people who deserve support.”

Dealing with suicidal thoughts

An important topic during the interview was Mack’s mental state following NXIVM exposure. Rosenbaum asked her former co-star if she had considered suicide, to which she revealed that she had. According to Mack, following the arrest of NXIVM leader Keith Raniere, she hid in Mexico, where she contemplated suicide:

“I had times of suicidal thoughts. I had a time when I was hiding in Mexico, when Keith was first discovered. [arrested]. […] And I was staying alone in a penthouse apartment for two weeks, and I didn’t know what was happening. And I went out onto the balcony and I thought, “I could jump, and this could be over.”

However, she stopped out of a desire to know what was next for her: “But then I thought, ‘But then I won’t know what happens next, and I want to know what happens next, and it will be different tomorrow.’ So I just have to hold on to that, because it’s going to be different tomorrow.”

Despite this, his suicidal thoughts returned. Mack said that after returning home to her family, she again considered suicide. However, thinking about her mother made her reconsider the following:

“We had paparazzi outside my parents’ house, so I couldn’t go anywhere without being sued for really negative reasons, and it was really painful. I was flying back to New York regularly to deal with my lawyers and eventually the prosecutors, and the whole thing was really painful. It was so heavy, and I had times where I was like, ‘I don’t know if I can take this anymore.’ do that.” So I didn’t.”

We asked Mack if she considered herself brainwashed, to which she replied that she had been. NXIVM asked its members to be marked with the initials of Keith Raniere. Rosenbaum asked him if the branding had been his idea. Mack said no, although he had took credit for it in an interview with the New York Times:

“No. I took credit for it [Laughs] in the New York Times article. […] No, it wasn’t my idea. No, those are not my initials. I will take credit for the things I actually did, and I didn’t do them.”